If I may add to this confusion, VIN 500 in Cleveland, OH has no rivets on the dash plate. It has the holes for it, and the unique "Belfast N-Ireland" with the number framed in black. I guess it is glued on as well. Greg -----Original Message----- From: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of James Espey Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:43 PM To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [DML] Re: Black Vin plates In the USA, at least, model years of cars are defined by the 10th character of the VIN. 1981 DeLoreans have the letter "B", 1982 DeLoreans have the letter "C" and 1983 DeLoreans have the letter "D". The last shipment of cars from the factory WHILE IT WAS STILL CONTROLLED by JZD/DMC came in January of 1982. From that point forward through about May of 1982, cars continued to be built and were parked either at the docks or the factory. In November 1982, when Consolidated bought these already built cars, the model year in the states had already shifted "production-wise" to 1983 models. By the time Consolidated was able to get these 1000 or so cars to the states, it would be January/February of 1983. Based on the VIN, these cars would have to be sold as 1982 models. So, Consolidated replaced all the VIN plates on these cars, changed the "C" to a "D" and added 5000 to the "serial" number at the end of the VIN. On most of these cars you can remove the headliners and see the original VIN handwritten on the door. These plates were glued on, because it is ver difficult to get the old rivets out completely, and also difficult to get the new rivets in with the dash/windshield installed. The cars that were still on assembly line, partially completed, that had sat from May 1982 to November or so had not yet had VIN plates put on the cars, so it was easy to install the VIN plates correctly. These are the 20XXX series VINs. Look for an article on this in an upcoming "deloreans" magazine, with an interview with someone from Consolidated who was there at the time. It's an interesting look at the production numbers, and helps to understand why the exact number of DeLoreans made is somewhat of a mystery. James Espey DMC (Texas) --- In dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Nelson, Allan" <abnelson@...> wrote: > > I'm not questioning the accuracy of what was stated below but how would > 10XXX and 12XXX VINs "appear to be a year old"? The VIN (at least the > last 5 digits in this case) is simply a build sequence number. How > would anyone interpret a build date from that? The build date is still > printed on the plate in the door jamb, correct? This would seem to be > where people could get the idea that the car has been sitting around a > while, not the dash plate. Just curious. > > > > Al > > > > ________________________________ > > From: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf > Of Jack Stiefel > Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 8:22 AM > To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Black Vin plates > > > > Ok I knew there was something different when I glanced at the plate on > 16879. I didn't look at 3461 until this morning. > > Thanks James > > Jack Stiefel > > moderator snip To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address: moderators@xxxxxxxxxxx For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:dmcnews-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx mailto:dmcnews-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: dmcnews-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/