Re: [DMCForum] Posting FROM Marc Levy about Moderation

[Chuck McKnight <gullwingdoors@xxxxxxxxx>]

Yeah, I'm not one to side with Marc very often, but I'd have to agree with him on this one.

Chuck McKnight

Jon Heese <dmcforum@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:                                  Hmmm... Here's my take on this.
 
 I agree with Ryan on a lot of issues (although moderation is definitely 
 not one of them) and I think he is a very decent, intelligent guy.
 
 Marc is also clearly intelligent, though a little quick to jump into 
 controversy sometimes.  All the same, I see that as nothing to hold 
 against him.
 
 So let it be known that I have no axe to grind with anyone here, nor 
 have I been in private contact with anyone here (in the last 4-6 months).
 
 However, on this one, it sure looks to me like most of the facts that 
 Marc states below are more or less accurate.  As far as I see it, the 
 motivation to ban Marc from posting is far from a public mandate and 
 sure seems on the surface to be in violation of the rules quoted by Marc 
 below.
 
 I suppose that if my actions in this post are in violation to a forum 
 rule (do forum politics count?), I'll happily leave it alone here, but I 
 think what Marc brings up below bears discussion.
 
 Thoughts?
 
 Regards,
 Jon Heese
 
 Kevin Abato wrote:
 > All:  I am forwarding this message on behalf of Marc Levy due to the fact
 > that he can no longer post here without moderation (see message below for
 > details on why).  I personally do not follow the forums closely and the
 > facts, topics, and views in the following message are Marc's and not my own.
 > 
 >  
 >  
 > <Snip ---  FROM MARC --- Snip>
 >  
 >> Forum Members:
 >>
 >> What has Walt's "Freedom of speech" forum become?
 >>
 >> Please read this entire message.  I know it is long
 >> winded.
 >>
 >> Most of us here joined an UN-MODERATED mailing list
 >> for DeLorean owners and enthusiasts.  Things were
 >> going well until Walt made a critical mistake.  He
 >> entrusted Greg with the power of "ownership" in the
 >> list.  This mistake later resulted in Greg removing
 >> Walt as a member, and action which was never
 >> discussed
 >> with Walt.  Greg essentially "took over" the list on
 >> his own.  Walt wrote to me about this and said
 >> "looks
 >> like Greg has fucked me too".
 >>
 >> No one much noticed, or cared.  Walt was not
 >> participating much in the list, and Greg continued
 >> to
 >> run things the way they had always been...  Until
 >> one
 >> day he decided we were loosing too many members (in
 >> HIS opinion) when the list got on to a non-DeLorean
 >> topic.  Specifically, Politics and Religion.  What
 >> to
 >> do?  September 15. 2005 he created 2 polls asking
 >> the
 >> members their opinion on allowing politics and
 >> religion on the forum.  The polls can be found at:
 >>
 >>
 >  <http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/surveys?id=1335588>
 > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/surveys?id=1335588
 >>
 >  <http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/surveys?id=1335590>
 > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/surveys?id=1335590
 >> I, Being a moderator of the list, was vocal against
 >> any censorship or rules that limited free speech.
 >>
 >> As all of this was happening, Greg decided to make
 >> Ryan a moderator.  Seemed like a good choice, being
 >> that they tended to be on the "same side" of most of
 >> our discussions.
 >>
 >> So, the vote is called based on Ryan's
 >> interpretation:
 >>  We will not allow politics and religion, and he
 >> came
 >> up with a set of "rules".
 >>
 >>
 >  <http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/message/30562>
 > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/message/30562
 >> Shortly after, I was banned for having a discussion
 >> ABOUT the rules.  There was no discussion of
 >> religion
 >> or politics, but as soon as I publicly disagreed
 >> with
 >> Ryan and Greg I was booted off. 
 >>
 >>
 >> I reluctantly returned to the Forum, through much
 >> persuasion of other members. 
 >>
 >> So, a few months later here we go again!
 >>
 >> Ryan is not happy with simply ruling the DMC Forum,
 >> He
 >> wants to rule all internet communications about
 >> DeLoreans.  So much so, that he HAS abused his
 >> current
 >> power to again censor the outspoken (in this case,
 >> me).  Without warning, he removed my ability to post
 >> to the list.
 >>
 >> My "rule braking" message can be found here:
 >>
 >>
 >  <http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/message/34107>
 > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/message/34107
 >> I am not sure where in that message there is
 >> discussion of religion, or politics.  But, does it
 >> matter?
 >>
 >> More importantly, why did Ryan not follow his OWN
 >> RULES:
 >>
 >> "...
 >>
 >> Discussions that the moderators deem inappropriate
 >> will be handled as
 >> follows:
 >>
 >> 1. A public warning will be posted in the relevant
 >> thread.
 >> 2. Members who ignore the warning may be subject to
 >> a
 >> brief revocation of posting privileges.
 >> 3. Continued violations will be handled on a case by
 >> case basis.
 >> 4. In the interest of full disclosure, moderator
 >> actions will be posted to the list.
 >>
 >> ..."
 >>
 >>
 >> No "public warning" was posted on this matter.
 >>
 >> Since there was no warning, there was none to
 >> ignore,
 >> therefore this action is against established policy.
 >>
 >> **** The actions taken by Ryan have not been posted
 >> to
 >> the list, "In the interest of full disclosure".  Why
 >> should he?  He is simply using his power to silence
 >> me. 
 >>
 >> So, now that you all know what is going on...
 >>
 >> Frankly, I can just go away again.  The mailing list
 >> is just a form of entertainment.  It is not critical
 >> or even necessary.  The point of me taking the time
 >> to
 >> write this is so there is a record of what went
 >> on...
 >> And if at any point in the future someone considers
 >> moving to any forum run by Ryan, they know who they
 >> are dealing with.
 > 
 > 
 > 
 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
 > 
 > 
 > 
 >  
 > Yahoo! Groups Links
 > 
 > 
 > 
 >  
 > 
 > 
 > 
 
     
                       

 		
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