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There are 4 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)
From: Christian Williams <delorean@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
2. Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas@xxxxxxxx>
3. Re: Steering wheel removal - the tool
From: Delorean17@xxxxxxx
4. Re: Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt@xxxxxxx>
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Message: 1
Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 18:23:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Christian Williams <delorean@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)
Joe,
How many of these bolts are there? Where are they located? What needs to
be moved (or removed) to get to them?
-Christian
On Thu, 23 May 2002, DMC Joe wrote:
> Clunking noises emanating from the rear of the car during slight body
> twisting are usually generated between the fiberglass body and chassis.
> Tightening up the body to chassis bolts will usually eliminate this
noise.
>
> DMC Joe
> Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 01:26:22 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)
--- In dmcnews@xxxx, "Walter Coe" <Whalt@xxxx> wrote:
<SNIP>
> The best cure, obviously, is to keep the fuel cool. The easiest
place to
> start is reducing the heat transfer from the coolant pipes. As
you may
> already know, aluminum is an excellent conductor of heat. And
there isn't
> much room for insulation between the pipes & the fuel tank. I
suggested
> before that an easy improvement would be to replace these
sections of
> aluminum pipe with long pieces of silicone hose
<SNIP>
Yes, I figure that it is the coolant pipes that are heating the tank
up. Another member off of the list did reccomend to me trying the
exhaust wrap for the pipes. So this too is an option that I'm
looking into. I really don't want to replace the existing aluminium
pipes with rubber hoses. This just worrys me in as it's two more
items that I have to worry about rotting/replacing in the years to
come.
<SNIP>
> > Now, from all this, I have determined the following:
> > 1. A noisy fuel pump isn't always due to a collapsing fuel
pick-up
> > hose.
>
> You got that right! I installed a spring in my hose, too, and it
seems to
> only make the problem worse -- by conducting the sound
better and by
> producing more restriction/turbulence.
<SNIP>
Add to this the fact the spring is yet another component to be
installed. I stand behind it in as it is a fix that can keep the fuel
hose from collapsing, but it is not what I would consider a
permanent solution for my issue. I'm currently working on a way
to not only remove the spring from the equasion, but the entire
pickup hose as well. The less parts, the better, and I'd like to
remove the main source that started this problem in the first
place.
<SNIP>
> > 2. Air flow from the front radiator is NOT heating the fuel.
When I
> > stopped the air flow, the noise became worse. It wasn't until I
> > restored air flow that there was a sign of cooling.
>
> This contradicts what I've read about installing an air dam. I
would like
> to hear more about your theory here. I have found that once the
fuel gets
> hot enough to cavitate, it stays hot for a long time.
<SNIP>
I have thought about this, and have come up with a couple of
theories: 1. Air flow is what is sufficient to cool the tank down. or
2. The coolant pipes on both sides of the radiator are transfering
heat thru the fuel. Gasoline is absorbing heat from the source
pipe, it then travels thru, and is reabsorbed by the cooler return
pipe. While parked, the tank absorbed heat from the hot line, but
was unable to lose the heat fast enough because cooler pipe
had no water flow to carry the heat away. But once I drove a
couple of miles, the temperatures recooled to the "balanced"
level they were at before.
Now, to add to this, another possibility that has crossed my
mind: Does heat directly transfer from the water pipe into the
gastank? Or, is the heat absorbed thru the plate below
protecting the gas tank? If the bottom plate is absorbing the
heat, this would make total sense! Heat being transfered thru
would turn the sheild protecting the gastank into a huge
"hotplate"! And the reason that we would not see these same
kind of symptoms in the winter is because the metal plate is
able to transfer heat much easier than the composite material in
the gas tank. Just like electricity, heat would transfer thru the
path of least resistance, and would be absorbed by the ambient
air flow under the car!
In any case, air flow from the radiator is NOT the culprit of hot
fuel tanks. IMO, the DeLorean has one of, if not the best
radiators for cooling the engine. Other vehicles typicly push air
into the engine compartment, and it has not other choice but to
exit out of the bottom of the car. With the DeLorean, hot air flows
out thru each of the front wheel wells, as well as the bottom. Not
just for the coolant, but the A/C always cools down quickly, and
stays cold! Putting the air dam in place is not a good idea. It's a
waste of money, it can cause vapor lock-up @ high speeds, and
has no impact on the fuel tank at all. Only a VERY small portion
of the top on the fuel cell is actually exposed to air from the
radiator.
<SNIP>
> This thought has crossed my mind too. (briefly :-) I envisioned
a fuel tank
> cover made of aluminum with heat-sink fins running the length
of it. Then
> you would need a really big smear of heat sink compound
between it and the
> tank. (Yeah, right :-)
<SNIP>
Don't laugh just yet, that may just be the thing we need. I don't
know how we could attach fins to the bottom plate, but it should
do the trick to rid the tank of excess heat. The only question I
would have is how well does the compound adhere to things? If
removal of the tank were nessisary in the future, You'd want to
make sure that you could easily seperate the two.
<SNIP>
> Another thing to consider is using an inline fuel radiator. A
nice spot for
> one would be in the frame next to the fuel accumulator, but
there isn't much
> room for air flow through here. There is plenty of room in the
engine
> compartment, but instead of stagnant cool air we have
turbulent hot air.
<SNIP>
I don't think that a fuel radiator of any sort sould be nessiasry at
all. Even if you installed one, I don't believe that it would allieviate
the problem. It would cool the fuel behind the pump, and that
isn't where the heat source is at. Rather than trying to keep hot
fuel cool, let's keep the fuel from getting hot at all, and use the
heat sink on the bottom to rid the gas of any stray heat that may
have entered. Although if we insulate the water pipes, and
remove the pickup hose to kill the noise, we may not even need
to go to that far of an extreme with the bottom plate.
<SNIP>
> On a more sarcastic note, it almost seems a shame that they
go to the
> trouble to plumb coolant from the engine to the heater core
when they could
> have instead substituted hot fuel. All the heat you would ever
need could
> be taken from the fuel return line. :-)
> Walt
I don't think that the engineers had thought of this problem of hot
gas comming up. At least not in the kind of hot environments that
our cars are in. It has to be the bottom plate acting as a heat sink
in cold weather that keeps the fuel cool. Otherwise, Noisy fuel
pumps would be a problem on EVERY DeLorean on the road.
-Robert
vin 6585 "X"
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Message: 3
Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 21:56:54 EDT
From: Delorean17@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Steering wheel removal - the tool
Thanks for all the help on removing the steering wheel. I decided not to
take the easy way out. Instead of taking the wheel off I just removed the
steering column(again) and lined it up so the steering wheel is straight
when
driving. I was two teeth off on the spline shaft on the end of it. I
forgot
to mark it this winter when replacing the lower bushing so my wheel was
turned when going straight! my bad,
Thanks!
David
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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 22:10:38 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)
> Has anybody with the
> dreaded clunk taken the time to remove the large bolts and carefully
> examine the condition of the bushings, and make sure that the bolts
> are straight and tight?
Now that you mention it, the camber of my rear tires seems to change very
slightly. And I emphasize "seems" because I am only eye-balling it.. I
noticed it more with the low profile wheels. But the OEM rims appear to
have more or less camber depending on the car's mood at the time.
Walt
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