[DML] Re: DeLorean Engine w/ regard to 3.0L swap

["jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Besides being probably the cheapest alternative, one of the most compelling reasons to fix up the one you got is that you know it's service history. In my mind the biggest reason to get another motor and rebuild it is that you can do it and still drive the car till you are ready to swap the motors. It can be very easy to get carried away and start "improving" things. Hotter cams, better fuel and ignition systems, etc. This can raise the cost very quickly once you start down that road. If you can stay stock you can keep the costs WAY down. One way to stay focused is to have a plan and a budget BEFORE you start.
David Teitelbaum

--- In dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Martin Gutkowski" <martin@...> wrote:
>
> I would give the cheapest price and easiest choice to "fix the existing engine" in a heartbeat
> 
> Martin
> 
> Sent from my BlackBerry®
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Nick Kemp <nkemp@...>
> Sender: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2012 19:31:13 
> To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Reply-To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [DML] Re: DeLorean Engine w/ regard to 3.0L swap
> 
> When I replied I was replying in the context of the job at hand and it 
> was not intended to imply that it was a simple job. So lets talk about 
> it in terms of relative effort:
> - Have someone rebuild the existing engine *HARD*
> - Replace with a good 2.8 *HARD*
> - Replacing with the 3.0L engine as per your comments *HARDER*
> - Replacing with something that does not bolt to the bellhousing *HARDEST*
> 
> - Rebuild your own engine ... I couldn't decide if it should be *harder 
> *or *hardest*.
> 
> I've removed the engine & tranny once and the tranny one more time. 
> Those are not easy projects in absolute terms.
> 
> Bob Villa used to say something like ..."make an estimate of cost & time 
> .... double the cost and quadruple the time". It works for car projects 
> as well.
> 
> FWIW I have a 3.0L in the garage, 18K miles (supposedly), a lot less 
> that $350 and the only engine management I'd consider is something that 
> I could tune myself and likely it will be a MegaSquirt. The stock engine 
> management computer is interesting only in terms of its simplicity... 
> after one figures out a good alternative for the trigger wheel (which 
> you also need with MegaSquirt) ... but again I'm talking in relative 
> terms. I suspect performance would be "sorta adequate maybe".
> 
> Nick
> 
> 
> Matthew wrote , ----On 6/16/2012 11:26 AM ---------------------------:
> >
> > I have to smile every time I see the domestic 3.0L PRV referred to as 
> > "plug and play!", "drops right in!" and "easy as it gets!" This is 
> > almost always from someone who has only made a cursory visual 
> > comparison between it and the stock 2.85L engine. I suppose the 
> > excitement also comes from the fact that you can find a 3.0L from a 
> > junkyard for around $350.
> >
> > The 3.0L as it came from the donor car uses a special trigger wheel 
> > attached to the flexplate for the automatic transmission, which was 
> > the only option available. Since you won't be able to use the 
> > automatic transmission (not without substantial machine and 
> > electronics work, anyway), you can forget about using the stock 3.0L 
> > computer. Theoretically you could make a similar trigger ring which 
> > would bolt to the DeLorean flywheel, but for all of that effort, 
> > trying to use the stock computer would still leave you severely 
> > handicapped should you ever need to troubleshoot a rogue sensor, 
> > misfire, etc or other weird problem. There is no way to connect a 
> > laptop to it to see what's going on. Also bear in mind, that there is 
> > no stock ignition or fuel table for the 3.0L available. Until you have 
> > the car dyno-tuned (around $400), it will run marginally at best, but 
> > will be streetable after some initial seat-of-pants tuning.
> >
> > Now that we've settled on aftermarket engine management, (which will 
> > cost between $300 - $1500+ depending on how much you want to have to 
> > screw with it), you can worry about how it "bolts in." This will 
> > entail stripping the 3.0L engine down to where you can remove the 
> > lower crankcase and swap it with the DeLorean lower crankcase, oil 
> > pan, oil pickup, and baffle assembly. This will let you mount it the 
> > same way the 2.85L did. Sound easy? Yes, but don't make a mistake. 
> > Failure to properly torque the main cap bearings correctly will ruin 
> > the engine. Failure to precisely align the lower crankcase with the 
> > block (yes, there is "play" in it) will mean that you could crack your 
> > bellhousing when attaching it, or have oil leaks from the timing 
> > cover. Failure to properly clean and apply anaerobic sealant between 
> > the block and lower crankcase will mean oil leaks there, too. Failure 
> > to reinstall/replace the rubber o-rings at the oil pickup will mean 
> > you never get the proper oil pressure.
> >
> > Now that the engine is mounted in place, time to drive the car, right? 
> > Nope. You don't have spark or fuel control, for one. This is where 
> > things get interesting. I have seen many variations, but all will 
> > require access to a machine shop ($85/hr here). If you don't mind 
> > attaching sensors with hose clamps, or can do your own machining, 
> > fine, but otherwise figure about $1200-$2000 in odds and ends that no 
> > one ever thinks of at first. This includes several custom brackets, 
> > whatever method of getting a trigger you choose (i suggest a crank 
> > trigger), new or cleaned injectors, new spark plugs, new plug wires, 
> > ignition coil, new fuel line & connectors, ignition module, misc 
> > vacuum fittings, numerous sensors, idle speed control valve and 
> > mounting bracket, new A/C compressor, new A/C hoses or hose-ends, 
> > everything else for R134A, since if not already converted, you may as 
> > well do it now, exhaust/intake/oil pan/throttle body gaskets, new 
> > serpentine pulley for your stock alternator, new idler 
> > pulleys/bearings, new serpentine belt, machining/welding for a custom 
> > alternator bracket, misc wires and relays, new water pump & gaskets, 
> > rigging up the throttle cable, and we haven't even fabricated the 
> > intake and air filter setup yet (no, the stock 3.0L filter box won't 
> > fit)!
> >
> > So now to summarize, you have:
> > ~350 (junkyard engine) + 300/1500 (engine computer) + 400 (dyno) + 
> > 1200/2000 (misc) = $2250 - $4250
> >
> > ....and we haven't done any plating/polishing/powder coating, we 
> > didn't rebuild the junkyard engine, and we're re-using your old stock 
> > exhaust. Without any doubt, there are things that I've missed above, 
> > but hopefully it gives you a good idea.
> >
> > Been there, done that, still fixing it.
> >
> > Matt
> > #1604
> >
> > --- In dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com>, 
> > "Martin Gutkowski" <martin@> wrote:
> > >
> > > You have to have a crank angle sensor and the original pickup would 
> > have been on the transmission flex plate, not part of the engine
> > >
> > > Martin
> > >
> > > Sent from my BlackBerry®
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: stevedmc@
> > > Sender: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:46:54
> > > To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> > <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com><dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> > <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > > Reply-To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [DML] DeLorean Engine
> > >
> > > Why go mega squirts? You could pop an eagle premier engine in there 
> > and leave its stock efi fuel system intact. You would have the benefit 
> > of efi without having to program one.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Steve
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jun 15, 2012, at 3:22 PM, Nick Kemp <nkemp@> wrote:
> > >
> > > > How about half way between a DeLorean engine and a non-DeLorean 
> > engine
> > > > .... the 3.0L PRV from the Eagle Premier or Monaco. Mechanically 
> > it is a
> > > > bolt in. Controls wise you'll have some project work. MegaSquirt 
> > is the
> > > > first thing that comes to mind for the controls. That said, I've
> > > > wondered if the original engine management would work or be easily
> > > > adapted to work.
> > > >
> > > > You've likely thought of the PRV alternative but I just thought I'd
> > > > bring it to the surface.
> > > >
> > > > Wishing I was in FL,
> > > > Nick
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
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