Re: [DML] Re: Alternate Fuels..

["Martin Gutkowski" <martin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Do some simple sums on the amount of energy in a tank of fuel then work out how long it'd take for a solar panel to transfer that energy. Factor in the (in)efficiency of the hydrogen generation, and work out the square yardage of panels you'd need to "re-fuel" your car in a reasonable length of time. 

I think you'll find in very short order that what you propose is thoroughly impractical and/or prohibitively expensive.

For me it comes down to how crap solar is as a renewable energy source. Wind might work on a domestic scale but your neighbours might not like you for it...

Martin

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message-----
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj@xxxxxxxxx>
Sender: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2012 07:24:46 
To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [DML] Re: Alternate Fuels..

The goal is conservation of money... not energy.  :)

If I can use free solar power to convert cheap/free water in to hydrogen, then run my car on it, it will cost me less money than gasoline.. Energy loss in conversion seems irrelevant if the energy is "free" to begin with. 

--- On Fri, 3/2/12, Martin Gutkowski <martin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> From: Martin Gutkowski <martin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: [DML] Re: Alternate Fuels..
> To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Friday, March 2, 2012, 5:07 AM
> When discussing anything like this,
> it helps to consider energy conversion efficiencies. Every
> time you convert energy from one form to another, you do it
> at less than 100% efficiency. If you wanted to use mains
> power to get hydrogen by electrolysis then use that hydrogen
> to drive your can via a fuel cell, you've gone through 5
> energy conversions. Whereas running a car on gasoline only
> goes through 1, even if it is pretty inefficient it's still
> a better use of resources.
> 
> Solar cells are dreadful. Obtaining hydrogen by electrolysis
> and then compressing it is pretty bad. Commercially
> available hydrogen usually comes from methane and has carbon
> dioxide as a by product, even if the car it then propels has
> only water as an emission.
> 
> Also LH2, by volume, has less than a third of the energy of
> gasoline. Mad, but true. A hydrocarbon fuel really is the
> most efficient way of storing hydrogen.
> 
> I could go on...
> 
> Martin



------------------------------------

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators@xxxxxxxxxxx

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnewsYahoo! Groups Links





------------------------------------

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators@xxxxxxxxxxx

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnewsYahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/

<*> Your email settings:
    Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/join
    (Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
    dmcnews-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    dmcnews-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    dmcnews-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/