Re: [DML] Nominate JZD to the Automotive Hall of Fame

["Brian McCool" <bjmccool@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

I found something interesting on the "Automotive Hall of Fame" website. If 
you look under the section "Distinguished Service Citation" , JZD's name 
appears in the list. Looks like he was awarded this in 1974. I noticed that 
quite a few people on the DSC list have been latter added to the Inductee 
list. Seems that it wouldn't be that far of a stretch to get John officially 
inducted.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "timnagin" <timnagin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2006 6:58 PM
Subject: RE: [DML] Nominate JZD to the Automotive Hall of Fame


>I should have added that had the original DMC been successful all of this
> would be moot.  Anything that John De Lorean is looked down on now would 
> be
> heralded as pure genius and a risk taker that succeeded against all odds.
> Hell, these internet groups and other websites probably wouldn't even 
> exist.
> Most of us probably wouldn't even have met each other.  Well, that last 
> part
> being a good thing is arguable. ;-)
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  _____
>
> From: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf 
> Of
> timnagin
> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 8:18 PM
> To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: [DML] Nominate JZD to the Automotive Hall of Fame
>
>
>
> While some behavior being moral or ethical is dependant on one's views,
> requiring this of all people inducted in the automotive hall of fame would
> eliminate all inductees and future inductees. In our current PC-correct
> annoying world what is immoral and unethical now may not have been back
> then. For example, CEO's traveling like John De Lorean did on the Concord
> and living lavishly was a sign the company was doing well. These days that
> is looked down upon as excessive. I don't think he was a saint, but he did
> have a vision and now we are all sitting in it.
>
> Several of the suppliers for GM were recently affected by their failings 
> and
> several people lost their jobs. Ford is experiencing similar events. Some
> have even accused Ford of actively backing the gay community which some 
> find
> offensive and can fall into that "moral and ethical manner" you mentioned.
> If Ford and GM are doing these things should anyone who was inducted that
> worked for either company be de-listed from the hall of fame? Should Henry
> Ford be removed?
>
> The suppliers for DMC, as with any other company, are in it for the money.
> There are no 100% guarantees in life and running a business and being
> business owners they know that, as I am sure John De Lorean did as well.
> With risk comes reward, hopefully, and they knew this entering into the
> agreements. If you invest in something and it fails then tough shit for
> you. I read about people going back and trying to sue the companies, and
> where there is actual intentional fraud this is justified. Someone
> investing for their own profit potential can be guilty of the same greed.
> If they didn't fully understand what they were getting into and what the
> risks could be then, again, tough shit. Who is more guilty of greed, the
> one taking the investment in hopes of a large return or the one investing
> the money for the same?
>
> I wouldn't say John De Lorean did what he did knowing he would absolutely
> never repay the investments; that would be a serious tactical failure. In
> fact, I understand he spent a lot of personal money repaying some 
> investors.
> I also understand Fred Dellis, of Legend Industries, remained good friends
> with him as well. Think about it, if he was only a con man and nothing 
> more
> then the one best way to ensure you will receive no other investments is 
> to
> screw the people who are investing in you. Being in the public eye as much
> as he was would further ensure no more investments. ENRON is a completely
> different matter, but it is interesting they and the original DMC were 
> both
> handled by the same accounting firm of Arthur Andersen, who was 
> investigated
> a few years ago for their business practices.
>
> As for the drug acquittal, someone please correct me if I am wrong but I
> understand he left a note stating he went to the meeting because of 
> threats
> against his family. I would think John De Lorean would be the only one to
> know the absolute truth about this and, well, we will never know for sure.
> In my opinion, his acquittal shows more about those trying to bring him
> down.
>
> Some people seem to think that taking down the competition is the best way
> to ensure their survival, rather than actually innovating and succeeding
> based on their product being superior. Have you seen the movie about
> Preston Tucker, Tucker: The Man and His Dream? The parallels between him
> and John De Lorean are astounding, even though they are separated by
> thirty-five years.
>
> As I understand it, people are Inducted for what they achieved, not 
> screwed
> up. The GTO and other innovations that he has patented, and the motoring
> world uses every day, just as with Preston Tucker, should be enough to get
> him in even if the DMC-12 is not.
>
> As always, anyone please feel free to correct any of my facts.
>
> Greg
>
> _____
>
> From: dmcnews@yahoogroups <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com> .com
> [mailto:dmcnews@yahoogroups <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com> .com] On
> Behalf Of
> Woody
> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 3:15 AM
> To: dmcnews@yahoogroups <mailto:dmcnews%40yahoogroups.com> .com
> Subject: Re: [DML] Nominate JZD to the Automotive Hall of Fame
>
> I'm on my second Delorean so I obviously like the car, feel it't very
> innovative and give the credit to John Delorean for creating such a
> unique car.
>
> That said, I feel that special recognitiion should be reserved for
> those that live their life and conducted their business in a that
> deserves the acolades. . . those that not only are creative and
> ambitious but live their live in a moral, ethical manner, that is, in a
> manner that you would want to be treated by someone you dealt with
> personally.
>
> My comments which follow will get the ire of those who hold JZD in some
> superhuman status that in my opinion he does not deserve.
>
> Sure, he designed a very innovative car.
>
> Sure, he had the ambition to make the car a reality.
>
> He also led a lot of suppliers down a path that led them into bankrupcy
> or business failure. He made promises he knew he could not keep. He
> took advantage of honest, trusting individuals to get them to continue
> to invest development funds (i.e., the turbo debacle) long after he
> knew he could not pay. He misled investors and employees in a manner
> that is reminicent of ENRON.
>
> How would you like it if you believed in someone, invested your life
> savings in their dream, only to find out they were using your money to
> live a jetset lifestyle? Do you find it OK for someone to take your
> life savings (or even your last paycheck) with a promise to repay when
> in reality they knew they never would be able to do so? Doesn't that
> make about as much sense as recognizing O.J. Simpson for his football
> accomplishments without recognizing the wrongful death judgment for
> murdering two people?
>
> Let's stay in the real world. Let's recognize the accomplishments
> associated with creating a new company to create a very innovative car
> (even withit's flaws). At the same time let's not put our head up our
> posterior when it comes to the flawed human traits that did
> conscious,avoidable, unjustifiable, irrepable harm to a lot of
> innocent, trusting individuals.
>
> I'm always open to new points of view so I welcome responses that are
> more than rationalizations of the acts of a creative, maniuplative,
> clever con man. And, lets not use the acquital on the drug charges to
> rationalize the ripoff of hundreds of suppliers. That's a logic jump
> reserved for those under 2 years of age.
>
> Woody
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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