Re: [DML] www.delorean.ie has been updated!

["John Dore" <dmcjohn@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Todd,

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!

The sandblasting cost me 450 Euros, but I had a lot of the external 
epoxy already stripped with the heat gun and nitromors paint 
strippers. The nitromors is cheap at about 7 Euros for a tin. Heat 
gun cost about 20 Euros.

I did most of the labour myself in cutting out the rusted metal - all 
you need is an angle grinder and a 1mm cutting disk. So I saved money 
here by not having to pay someone do this for me. I also saved a lot 
of labour fees by dismantling the car myself with my brother, and 
rebuilding it with him, my Dad, and some good friends. I'm sure it 
would be an expensive job to pay one of the DeLorean repair shops to 
do all this work for you!

The new metal which was welded into the frame (including getting some 
pieces of metal folded to different shapes) cost about 200 Euro.

The welding cost me 250 Euros. This included fabricating the panel 
under the steering mounts, fabricating the "u shaped" bracket inside 
the front cross member, welding all the new plates into the frame, 
fabricating and welding in the boxing plates for the upper and lower 
control arms, and also included pressing out all my old suspension 
bushings and lower ball joints, and pressing in the new polyurethane 
bushings and new lower ball joints. 

New parts such as all new polyurethane bushings, ball joints, 
steering shaft, brake pads, caliper and master cylinder rebuild kits, 
rear shocks, and a few other pieces cost probably 1500 or more. I'd 
need to check... Galvanising itself cost 100 Euro.

So, the frame restoration alone cost 100 for galvanising, 450 for 
sandblasting, 200 for metal and 250 for welding. Total cost = 1000 
Euros or 1200 US dollars.

I think overall, I did the restoration from start to finish for about 
2600 Euros (3260 US Dollars). I looked into the cost of the stainless 
frame, but by the time it would be shipped to my door, and all import 
charges paid for, it was costing just about 15,000 US Dollars!!! I 
could buy a whole DeLorean for that amount of money, so it is 
definitely not worth buying the stainless frame for anyone in Europe 
in my opinion.

The galvanising is just as good a job as the stainless steel frame, 
provided that it is galvanised properly. To galvanise properly, the 
most important thing is that there is absolutely no paint left on the 
frame, inside or out, before galvanising.

Ed Uding in the Netherlands has the best system I've seen for 
stripping the epoxy from DeLorean frames. He puts them in a vacuum 
furnace at 450 degrees, and the paint turns to black dust, and falls 
off the frame.

We don't have this facility in Ireland unfortunately, which is why I 
chose to sandblast (and cut openings in the frame to allow 
sandblasting inside). I'm sure the facility that Ed uses is available 
in the USA however....

I can't stress enough how crazy it is to follow the advice that is 
sometimes given that "there is no need to strip the epoxy - it will 
burn off during galvanising". This is absolute rubbish, and in my 
opinion will significantly increase your chances of warping your 
frame, due to the much longer submersion required to burn the epoxy. 
A frame that is galvanised like this will rust again, no doubt about 
it. It is also a very dangerous method for the workers in the 
galvanising factory, as the frame with epoxy on it will not sink 
fully into the molten zinc, but will float, requiring it to be 
manually pushed under the surface using a metal bar or something 
similar.

Anyway, if done correctly, galvanising is definitely the best 
solution for our frames. They do not warp during the process, even 
frames with significant repairs done to them before galvanising. 
Galvanising will last 100 years or more, at a fraction of the cost of 
the stainless steel frame.

You also mentioned stripping the frame, and just powdercoating it. 
Personally, after researching powdercoating, galvanising, and every 
other method out there, I would not just powdercoat the frame. 
Powdercoating will chip and scratch just like the original coating, 
and will allow rust to travel underneath it again. To go to the 
effort of stripping your car to that extent, then have it begin to 
rust again after a few years is a bit mad in my opinion.

Up until now, the main reason people have been put off galvanising a 
DeLorean frame is fear of it warping. I think that rumour can be 
safely put to bed now. Plenty of DeLorean frames have been 
successfully galvanised in Europe with absolutely no warpage. On my 
own frame, I measured from the hole at the top of the front left 
shock tower to the hole at the top of the rear right shock tower, and 
compared this measurement to the one taken from the front right to 
rear left shock towers. The measurement was exactly the same (to the 
milimeter) after galvanising. A few other measurements confirmed that 
the frame did not warp at all during galvanising.

The other thing about the stainless frame that I just realised the 
other day, is that the stainless steel frame loses out on a lot of 
the design detail features of the original frame. For example, the 
front frame extension in the stainless frame appears to be missing 
the edge strip on the top and bottom plates (in the center of the 
frame extension). Its hard to explain, but take a look at the 
pictures of the stainless frame on the website 
http://www.deloreancarshow.com and then compare them to the pictures 
of the front of my frame, and you will see what I mean.

There are other areas on the stainless steel frame where again, 
design features are lost, such as the plate under the engine cross 
member with the ribs stamped into it. Or, the pressed holes on the 
bottom of the front frame extension, through which you bolt on your 
steering rack, are now just flat holes. Basically, it seems anywhere 
where there was once a stamped design, it has been replaced by laser 
cut flat pieces. I know that you can argue that these little 
features "are not needed", and that the frame is strong enough 
without them...

In my opinion, it doesn't take much effort to keep these little 
design features, especially for a such a high price tag, and its nice 
to keep the frame looking as original as possible.

My advice is to galvanise your frame, and spend your savings of 9 or 
10 thousand dollars on other areas of your car, or even buy yourself 
another restoration project DeLorean! You'll have a chassis every bit 
as rustproof as a stainless steel frame, while keeping the original 
look of the DeLorean frame. You can even powdercoat the galvanised 
chassis back to grey to really have it look original. If you're 
thinking that the stainless frame has the additional benefit of extra 
strength over the original frame, you can always do as I did, and 
weld in thicker than original metal in key areas.

Best of luck and let me know if you have any other questions.

Thanks,

John Dore, Ireland.

http://www.delorean.ie



--- In dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Todd Nelson" <tan5732@...> wrote:
>
> John:
> The restoration looks great, it's good to know there will be at 
least a few DeLorean's on the road for many years to come.  If you don't mind me asking, how much did all of this cost!? 





To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators@xxxxxxxxxxx

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    dmcnews-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/