RE: [DMCForum] Joint Ventures, tank senders, keys, etc.

["John Hervey" <john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

James, I totally understand where your coming from with joint ventures and
trying to work a product between two parties, I to own a business for the
past 12 years with 16 people and trying to invest money into new product and
for the long term, it isn't easy I know.. Yes, I have resurrected a product
recently and also have done some modifications to existing ones, but your
right, they didn't require some of the in depth testing as yours, but it
should be that way since DMCH is what I call the dealer and would beneifit
the most in the long run. Remember last year when everyone was talking about
drivers door torsion bar, I was ready to have them remanufactured, but only
2 or 3 people would have bought because as you know when they become
available and they are no longer a threat of not getting them, then everyone
moves on to something else and even with the Delorean community support, 8
years payback isn't what Steve and I have talked about.
 I will email you off line and discuss the $4,000.00 I just spent to bring
back a part that has been gone and some of the other modifications that have
been done to make our cars better and safer and more reliable on the road if
you like.
It would be nice to have a working relationship with all vendors ( network )
so if one is going to build this or that, then all the vendors would support
that person and you could move on to something else.
John Hervey

  -----Original Message-----
  From: James Espey [mailto:james@xxxxxxxxxx]
  Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2003 10:45 AM
  To: dmcforum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Subject: [DMCForum] Joint Ventures, tank senders, keys, etc.


  I get the digest version of this list, so please forgive that I am lumping
  many replies into the same message.

  Hervey wrote:
  > There are some parts I can do and will do, But Houston is the lead in
  > the role of redoing some parts like the fuse block. If the joint
  > venture was formed to reproduce the fuse block and other parts and
  > everyone was going to share in it then i would participate, but that
  > won't be the way it will be. Some just want to do their own thing.

  Before I get in to this subject (as well as some others) in depth, John -
  what DeLorean-specific parts have you actually DONE? I don't mean gone out
  and found a cross-reference for, or modified something else to work? I
mean
  actually having discovered a part that is unavailable, had it tooled,
  prototyped, tested, tested, tested, possibly re-tooled, re-prototyped,
  tested, tested, tested, produced in quantity and then offered to the
market?
  None that I am aware of! (rant mode off)

  Hervey wrote some more:
  > What kind of profit should vendors make for the investment and inventory
for a
  > year.

  A year! Wow, I'd love to have that kind of ROI on some of the parts we are
  making now! I don't expect to see ANY PROFIT on a particular part we are
  having quoted now for EIGHT YEARS - that's eight years just to get back
what
  we'll spend to have them made! That's the difference between people that
go
  out and buy something "off the shelf" and businesses and actually PRODUCE
  something.

  Hervey concluded:
  > My mother once told me if you can't say anything good then your better
off
  > not saying anything at all.

  My mother told me not to let anyone walk over me and to stand up for what
I
  believe in, popular or not. :-)

  As far as "joint ventures", they've been tried before. And they haven't
  worked for the parties involved. Here's a scenario that actually played
out
  as I'll describe it. Two companies got together to make a part that was
  unavailable, splitting the costs 50/50 and dividing the parts the same
way.
  A retail price was set that both agreed to stick to so that a reasonable
  profit could be made and neither would have an unfair advantage over the
  other (since they were both equal partners inthe part). All was great for
  about a year. Then one of the companies got in a financial crunch and
  ignored the agreed retail price, cutting it dramatically. The other
company
  lost sales as a result. That's why no one wants to do joint deals anymore.
  You can't fault the first company for doing what they did - they did what
  they needed to do to help themselves survive. But now no one wants to do
  them anymore...once bitten, twice shy.

  Walt wrote:
  > But then they compete on seemingly unnecessary things like key blanks,
fuel
  > suction hoses and other items.  The DMC/Texas blanks look most accurate
to
  > OEM but may not be as indestructible as the PJ Grady variety.

  Fuel hoses were something that was overpriced ($90+) and we used to buy
from
  Grady until he ran out and we couldn't get them from him for a period of
  time. That's why we made them. And our lower priced part is why his came
  down, too.

  As far as keys, I haven't seen his lately, but the first ones we got him
  (made by Ken Koncelik) were crap. Ken says he's changed his materials, but
  I'll still bet money that ours are more durable - have you bought one of
  ours? Wanna do a key-comparo? :-)

  Marc wrote:
  > For instance, the fuel sender was already
  > available from Zilla.  And now the angle drive, when reconditioned
  > units are available from PJGrady.

  At one time, when we needed senders from Grady, they were unavailable. We
  also weren't satisfied with the price on them, nor the performance. I've
  said all that before. Now everyone has a choice, and both products are far
  more affordable.

  As Walt said, Rob's HCR angle drives aren't available at the present. No
  more new ones are, either. Would you rather have a rebuilt unit for $170+
or
  a new one made from more durable materials for $70-80. It's win-win.

  I'm not arguing with you Marc, this is just my side of the story.

  Marc continued:
  > It's a shame that not only does DMCH keep
  > the parts that only they have artificaly high, but they also have to
  > try and under cut any item the other vendors dont buy from them.

  Who's to say that it's artificial? You have no idea:

  a) what we paid for the inventory
  b) what it costs to warehouse and maintain the inventory
  c) what replacement costs will be when that inventory is depleted

  Marc concluded:
  > If I had a hunk of money to spend on a project to
  > reproduce a part, it just makes more sense from a
  > business and "DeLorean Enthusiast" point of view to
  > first work on the parts that are unavailable with no
  > replacement...

  No, it makes more sense from a business point of view to reproduce parts
  that will provide an appreciable return on the investment in a reasonable
  amount of time. The proceeds of which can then be used to satisfy the
  "DeLorean Enthusiast" point of view you describe. More often than not, the
  two are mutually exclusive, and the latter have ROI's like the part I
  mentioned above.

  James


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor





  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  DMCForum-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
DMCForum-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.