RE: [DMCForum] Digest Number 1494

["Dan RC30" <danrc30@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Robert,
It's not easy to take you seriously when you can't spell "necessary"
correctly... j/k. Seriously, I agree with most of what you say. I usually
argue my point, but I figured I'd just be wasting my time typing a whole
bunch of stuff up which would only be ignored anyway. (Marc can vouch for my
arguments... he's witnessed/been involved in one first hand.) Anyway, in
short anyone that can't get past the fallacies of a book and are afraid to
see the real truth are in my opinion weak minded. They choose to "believe"
what they have been told all their life rather than open their eyes and deal
with the truth and reality as it really is. I said nothing about good, bad,
or the world needing or not needing religion. That's the HUGE topic that I
just don't want to get into right now because it will require way too much
typing, and it will only fall upon deaf ears...

---Evil Dan

If this offends some... sorry, but I didn't bring it up.




Message: 12        
   Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:34:43 -0000
   From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Religion on the Forum


--- In DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Dan RC30" <danrc30@xxxx> wrote:
> Religion is for the weak minded. I dislike ALL religions. It has brought
> nothing but corruption, misery, and death (not necessarily in that
order).
> 
> ---Evil Dan
> Seeing the truth clearly and not afraid of it...

The great struggle within all of us. The difference between humans,
and common animals is the fact that we can override our instincts with
logic. The problem however, is that instict is infalable, because it's
naturally written. Logic however is written on an individual basis,
and hence corruptable by a person's shortcomings. Now, keep this in mind.

You say that religion is for the weak minded. Well, that is a pretty
open-ended statement. Albeit one that I can both agree, and disagree
wtih. Religion is quite nessisary in many instances. In short, your
large number of people out there are idiots, ruled by their own
emotions. It's easier to beat a child, than it is to raise it. It's
easier to violently lash out at your problems, be it a thing or a
person, than it is to think things out and work them thru. It's more
rewarding to rob and steal, so that you can ingest drugs that bring
you pleasure, than say work a regular job and spend an entire life
worrying about your retirement. I agree, hell, I sympathise. But that
doesn't change the fact that it's wrong.

Now if a person cannont raltionalize these things for themselves, then
we must help them by explaning these things, and sometimes by
disciplining them. Ie our laws and legal codes. However, there are
times that this still doesn't work. And so, we have to "put the fear
of God into people.", literally. Supersition can work wonders, where
common sense has failed.

Now, does this mean that if someone is religious, or even spiritual,
that they are a weak minded individual? Certainly not. Like I first
said, what set us apart from animals, is the ability to replace logic
with reason. And many of us know to do what's right. In fact, we tend
to be compelled to do so. Now, if a person who does good by their
fellow man or woman wants to give the credit for their inspriation to
another (be it human or deity), that's fine. It's their business for
whom, or what they wish to give credit for their actions to. But all
along, they were a good person to begin with.

Plus spiritually-based fellowships do have many benefits of a social
nature, for all those who attend.

Religion is very nessisarry in our society. After all, we do need to
instill some sort of ethics into people who other wise wouldn't have
them, unfortunetly. It is in a sense, a form of "crowd control" when
it comes to keeping civil peace.

The problem here is not with religion itself, but rather with those
whom wish to further their own contemptible agendas by abusing it. Be
it to exorcise their personal delusions, or to cast into effect their
own predjudices and feed their own appetites. Greed, power, fear,
hatred, and obsession are all the driving factors of the corrupt sides
of religion. Religion has both benefits of providing these things that
people desire to acheive thru ill means, as well as package
justification without guilt for the individual. This works out well
for the feral people who care not about their adulterous liasons,
their abuse of illicit substances, or the domestic violence that they
wreak upon their families. After all, who cares about concequences,
when you can easily obtain absolution for ones own sins thru some
trivial pennance? Or in some cases, just by swearing to someone that
you accept a saviour? These are still not good people at heart, since
they care not about their actions.

And if you wish to weild an army of followers to exploit for your own
ends, all the better. A mob mentality is perfect when you want to
create and enlist followers. A person is less likley to speak out,
when everyone is against them. And this is when religions are used to
start wars, to create havoc, and justify killing in the name of
someone, something, or some spiritual cause. I think that Scientology
is the best example of this. L. Ron Hubbard was a uninpressive
science-fiction writer, and a failed author of a line of "Self-Help"
books. Hubbard's driving force was to become rich off of his writings,
which of course never happened. Over the years, Hubbard often told his
peers that the way to really make money, was to start a religion or a
cult. And thus his failed "Dianetics" books became the starting point
for Scientology, with drug-fueled "scriptures" and books that followed
suit (read 'OT III' to see what I mean) . And a cheap "Lie Detector"
that was advertised in many comic books, became a "tool" used in the
cornerstone of his cult: Auditing. And over the years, this religion
has been used to financially exploit people for both tangible assests,
and labor.

The biggest problems that I myself have with religion is not
nessisarily the religion itself. But rahter the followers that it
attracts. Latter Day Saints are the modern equivalent of Brahman
caste. One has to prove their faith in order to move up from attending
a Ward, to being accepted enough to gain admittance to a Temple. And
even then, there is a social structure within the Wards of people who
look down upon others because of the way they dress, their mannerisms,
financial status, etc. Pride at the case of inequality is also a very
nasty side effect of religion. Especially with people here in Vegas,
who some think that they have greater faith, then people who live
elsewhere with "less temptation". That's like being proud of things
you should or shouldn't be doing anyways. "Hey, I take care of my
kids!" Well, you're supposed to! There isn't anything special about that.

Now sure, these are my viewpoints, and all are welcome to agree, or
disagree. However, I will ask one thing: No matter what you disagree
with, or even despise in life, don't simply pass judgement on it, and
cast it aside. And if it's something that you think is really bad,
then ask yourself what you are doing about it? How will you change things?

-Robert





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