[DMCForum] Re: Child Car Seats In A Delorean

["wannadelorean" <mcquinlan@xxxxxxxxxx>]

--- In DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "ryanpwright" <yahoo1@xxxx> wrote:
> --- In DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "wannadelorean" <mcquinlan@xxxx> 
wrote:
> > > 
> > So then I shouldn't have to pay for the passenger side air bags
> > if I 
> > never carry a passenger?  How about my rear seat belts.  I never 
use 
> > them.  How about side curtain airbags for the rear.  Same 
argument 
> > holds.  Same with the pool.  If I don't have kids why do I need
> > the fence?  
> > 
> > You already pay for features that you won't use.  
> 
> Yes, because the auto manufacturer chooses to put them in. This is
> completely different from the government requiring those features.

Actually that isn't true.  Airbags, seat sensor, side curtains are 
all required by law.  Not a choice.  The auto manufacturers have 
adopted some of the features earlier than the law required but only 
because they were going to have to anyway.  It used to be that 
airbags were only required on the driver side but the laws keep 
getting more stringent.  The side curtains may not be required yet 
but there has been a law passed already that will make them 
mandatory.  These items would all be options if laws didn't exist 
requiring them.  

> 
> > We have blanket laws that cause all of us to incur expenses 
> > we will never benefit from.  All the safety features mentioned 
above 
> > are because the car COULD carry people in those seats not 
because 
> > they do. 
> 
> But again, this is not because the government requires it. The auto
> manufacturers put these features in of their own free will - the 
seat
> belts being an exception, of course.

See above.  Laws do exist that require them.  If there were no law 
then all these items would be an option.

> 
> > On the other side of the argument, what if I don't have kids but 
> > someone who wants to ride with me does?  Now they can't or must 
> > break the law because I don't have a car seat.  Do you expect
> > them 
> > to carry a car seat with them wherever they go?
> 
> Yes, I do. That makes a lot more sense than requiring every 
vehicle to
> have a car seat. Do you have children? I ask because you make
> "carrying a car seat wherever they go" sound like a big deal. It's
> not. Consider: Wherever you're at, if you have your kids, you also
> have your car seat. When we drive to a friend's house, the kids 
are in
> the carseat. If we then hop in that friend's car and go somewhere,
> guess what? The carseat is already with us. We just buckle it into
> their car and go.

Yes I do have kids and car seats.  We however don't have car seats 
in all of our cars.  I mostly drive my truck to work and it doesn't 
take car seats very well (The rear bench seat is at such an angle 
that the seat only rest on the very front of the seat.  The seat 
rocks badly from side to side.  No amount of pressure on the seat 
makes it sit right.

I have been a victim of the restrictions of car seats and it is a 
real pain when it happens.  My son had an severe alergic reaction to 
antibiotics and I rushed him to the hospital with our minivan (in a 
car seat).  He started with a mild rash and swollen joints.  At the 
time we thought it was a rash due to the cold he had (for which he 
was taking the antibiotics.  He had hives the day before and our 
pediatrician said it was normal) By the time I got to the hospital 
he could barely breath.  We were afraid he wasn't going to make it 
and my wife wanted to come to the hospital to see him.  She couldn't 
come because our other son was at home with her and I had the car 
seats in the minivan.  Come to think of it now.  If I had taken the 
time to switch my sons seat to my truck he probably wouldn't be 
alive today.  He was minutes away from  suffocation when I got him 
in the emergency room.

> 
> Car seats are required on aircraft, so anybody who flies with their
> young children will have one. They'll have it in the car when they
> drive to the airport, they carry it onto the airplane, and when 
they
> get to their destination it will already be with them for use in 
the
> rental car.
> 
> It's really not a big deal. It's just a part of having children and
> keeping them safe.

Well, this just isn't true.  There are no requirements for child 
seats on a plane.  There isn't even a requirement to buy them a seat 
if you can hold them.  I do fly with my kids frequently and have 
never used a car seat.  They sit in an adult seat with the lap 
belt.  One is 2 and the other is 4.  It would be a serious pain to 
have to bring my luggage and 2 car seats with me when I travel.  
This is just another example of the inconsistency with the laws.  I 
guess they figure that most plane crashes aren't survivable anyway.

Also, most times when I fly, once I get to my destination, I have to 
take a taxi or shuttle to a hotel or car rental agency.  During this 
time there are no car seats available.  If I brought my own, no one 
is going to let me hold up the van while I strap in a car seat.  
Like you said, it takes a half hour to install one the first time.

> 
> > Exactly.  This is why an idiot proof solution that was built 
into 
> > the car would be the safer way to go.  No (or less) chance of 
> > operator error.  
> 
> Let's get one thing straight: I don't have a problem with this if 
the
> auto manufacturers choose to do it. I simply don't think there 
should
> be a law requiring it. 
> 
> > seats will always be needed.  In Florida, a law was recently put 
> > fourth that would require children to be in a seat until 10 
years of 
> > age.  This is nuts.  I think over 1-2 years old a built in 
system 
> > could work better than the existing system.
> 
> Wow. That IS nuts! I have a 7 year old daughter who got out of her
> booster seat when she was 6. She was big enough to use a normal 
seat
> belt. Until 10 years of age?! Completely insane.

Luckily this law didn't pass but only because of a huge outcry by 
the public.  It was safety lobbiest that were trying to pass it.  It 
meant a new catagory of seat and more money for the car seat 
companies.


> 
> I'm all for letting parents decide when it comes to "older" kids, 
say
> above the age of 4 or so. Require them to be secured in some 
fashion,
> yes, but every kid is different and only the parents should be 
making
> the decision of "Is it time to move out of the car seat and use a
> normal seat belt?"
> 
> > So, since 80% of the people are idiots and can't put the seat in,
> > we 
> > should have a law that requires everyone with a seat to take it 
in 
> > to an inspection center and have it properly installed for 
them.  
> > Then we could have laws that require an annual inspection too.  
This 
> > is how our laws get out of control.  A law to make another law 
> > better and them more laws to make that one better.  It never 
ends.  
> > Let's make the law right the first time.
> 
> Of course laws like that would be silly. Car seats move from car to
> car often, and we can't be requiring inspections every time. I 
would
> prefer getting hospitals involved. Train one or two staff members 
on
> the proper installation of a car seat, and then they can teach the
> parents when the kid is born. My wife's midwife checked our car 
seat
> out when our son was born to make sure it was properly installed. 
It
> was just part of what she does. Also, our local fire department 
often
> has "car seat days" where you can bring your vehicle down and they
> will check it, and teach you how to do it right.

GM service centers will check out your seat too.  But in reality if 
you are too lazy to take the time to install it yourself what is the 
likelyhood that you will drive somewhere and have them do it for 
you.

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