Andrew, I really don't want to start a thread on the evidence for God,
since that'll clog up the archives and nobody will accept it anyway.
However, your post proves my point. You have to accept it, without it
being shown to you, or else why bother? If you can't trust the person
in charge of the universe with something....
"Don't you see that this is one of the main reasons Judeo-Christian-Islam
religions have "succeeded" where others fail? They insure themselves
against non-belief by forcing their followers to buy a bill of goods with
no proof the goods exist, and then claim lack of faith when someone wants
to see the goods."
Not really. I wasn't forced into anything. I believed as a kid, then
as I grew up I questioned it. From what I'd seen and heard, I decided
that this was the way to go, even when I was trying to get away from
my parents and all they had taught me for the sake of independence.
I questioned God the most, and ran through all the scenarios of "what
if this is wrong, what if they are right" over and over, and ended up
at God anyway.
"The analogy with car parts has been made in this thread before. Someone
posted that he never checked to see if his car had a gas tank, but has
faith that it does. I think that's horse shit. He knows the car has a
gas tank because it runs. He knows the car has engine because it runs.
There is empirical evidence that these parts exist. There is no
empirical
evidence a god exists."
Umm.. I just said that you have to believe as if it was true without
evidence. Personally, I think that God shows people who believe all
the evidence they need.
I sent a fairly long message to someone offlist last night that
explained some of the reasons I believe, and I'm pretty sure I managed
to sound like a wildeyed lunatic, but it was the truth. If you want
it, I can send it to you too. Do what you want, discredit it, find
alternate explanations, I know what I was through and if you don't
want to consider that someone might be right besides yourself, that's
not my problem... (I can be an Internet asshole if you can).
"Did any of you buy your cars without at least making sure they exist?
Without at least making sure then run? (Okay, those of you who bought
non-running project cars don't count.) If you don't buy a car this way,
why do you buy a religion this way? Is it just because your parents did,
and their parents before them? Is it just because belieiving in a
smiling
bearded man in the sky makes you feel good? I think these are ridiculous
reasons to adopt a belief system."
No, those are not my reasons. As I said, I have my own reasons for
believing. I questioned my beliefs, I looked at all the options I
could realistically take to explain what I thought was unexplainable
without using God, and came back to Him anyway.
"When I claim there is no empirical evidence of a god, many religious
people fall back on the faith crutch. "You don't need to have evidence.
You just have to believe. Why? Because I believe. Becuase the Bible
says to believe." I am a scientist and a mathematician. If I put this
kind of "evidence" in any formal article, I would laughed out of school.
But it works for religions. Why is this? I think it is because they prey
on fear of the unknown. They drop this faith crap in front of someone and
tell him he's either got to believe it or he's condemned to spend eternity
in hell. What do you expect the typical fearful human to do?"
This is the thing that burns me. If you have faith in something, it's
not unknown anymore. Personally, I believe that if there is no God,
then we will all just die at the end of our lives. I'm not afraid of
that, even if it was true.
The thing is, like I said, if God proves that He's there to diehard
anti-Christian people (like you) then there is no point. That would be
like worshiping your car, or your television, because now you can
prove conclusively that it's there. If you can't trust in something
and wait for it to be proven, I don't know what to say. How is that so
hard a concept to grasp?
Like I've said before, I believe that if you honestly have faith,
you'll get all the evidence you'll ever need to see why God is real.
"In science and math, we believe nothing until it is proven. Sorry
faithful folks, this is just the way I'm wired. I am literally unable to
put myself into a position of understanding how people can believe in that
for which there is zero direct evidence, and that which is hugely unlikely
based on the circumstantial evidence."
So prove to me that we evolved. Prove to me that there was a Big Bang,
that God (who is supposed to be all-powerful I might add) couldn't
create a universe in six days and make it appear to us as millions of
years.
Prove to me that we are actually right just because the math works
out. How do you know we aren't inventing science and math to explain
our universe out of "fear of the unknown" as you claim anyone with a
religion is?
Don't say "because it works to explain such-and-such" because God does
too. Prove you're right.
Now do you see how ridiculous it is for you to ask someone to prove
that God's there just because YOU don't believe in Him?
In the words of my friend, raWr.
You probably think my words are preposterous. Well, I think your ideas
are preposterous. I think that there is just as little evidence that
we didn't come from God as there is that we did.
Gotta end this mini-rant now, thunderstorms are a'comin'.
-Adam Stadnick
No Pigeon Forge this year
No VIN, yet (hoping for 3416)
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