> So which is better? Toby TAB or Walt TAB? Strength-wise they should be identical since they are made from the same Inconel 718 alloy. Toby-TABs are more cool looking since they have a bright sand-blasted finish and 12 point head. But the head can make them a pain in the ass to install if you don't have a 12 point offset wrench. If you want jam nuts, Toby says to go buy them at your local hardware. For whatever reason, Toby did not have his bolts threaded to OEM metric dimensions. I really don't like the nuts that he uses because they are not of the nylock variety. Instead one side of the nut has purposely damaged threads which then damages the threads on the bolts as you tighten them. The purpose, of course, is to make sure that they fit tight enough so that they don't come loose on their own. But as I tightened a Toby-TAB, I watched a piece of it extrude into a long piece of Inconel wire as the purposely damaged nut scraped part of the thread off. I really hated seeing this happen to a bolt that someone just paid a lot of money for. Walt-TABs are black & ugly but are more practical and costs less. They are made to metric specs, so they install and fit like the original bolts. They come with jam nuts and nylock nuts included. And most importantly, Walt-TABs are still available! Since Walt-TABs were commissioned at mine and Martin Gutkowski's request, we talked extensively with the manufacture to make the best bolts. The only dimension that we changed from OEM is that the shank on Walt-TABs are 95mm whereas the shank on OEM TABs are 86mm and Toby-TABs are 100mm. The reason for making the shank longer is that we wanted to be sure that the trailing arm didn't bear any load on a threaded portion of the TAB. Toby used a similar approach but maybe went too far (really a matter of opinion.) His 100mm shanks can be too long in some applications (depending on how many wheel alignment shims your particular car needs). So he provides extra washers to use as spacers to make up the difference. For Martin and I it was a close call deciding on what the optimum shank length should be. We chose 95mm because that is short enough to not require extra washers and yet long enough so that very few if any threads are load-bearing. We were concerned of the possibility that a future mechanic doing a rear wheel alignment might need to remove some shims and then not know that additional spacer washers are needed because a Toby-TAB shank is too long. So we made sure that Walt-TAB shanks are just long enough. They are 9mm longer than OEM TABs but 5mm shorter than Toby-TABs. Have I rambled on long enough already? And for you concours nuts, the black finish on Walt-TABs can be cleaned off to make them look OEM. Toby-TABs look noticeably different. Cool, but different. > Based on 20,000 mile condition of my factory original 10.9's would suspect that mere 12.9's would probably be fine as long as they're changed periodically, Uh, no. I have done TABs on 5 DeLoreans to date (actually crawling under the car and doing the work myself, not just selling the bolts). Of these 5 cars, only one had TABs that weren't bent, and those were relatively new TABs installed by PJ Grady. I haven't tried to keep "tabs" on how many people find bent ones, but there are a lot of bent ones. The guy selling the 12.9 bolts is John Hervey. Yeah, 12.9 should be stronger than 10.9, but I have questions. After he buys these bolts then he has them replated. But replating a bolt changes its hardness. I asked him about this, and he said that he has them retempered after he has them replated. So why start with an off-the-shelf bolt and then have it replated and retempered because the manufacturer went cheap on the original plating? Did they go cheap on anything else? Like are the threads rolled or cut? This is critical to how strong the bolt really is. How long is the shank and how did you choose that length? Has the hardness of the bolts been verified? I have all the technical certificates for the Walt-TABs and will get copies posted online soon. > Net splurge was only $20 (which included shipping BTW). Bill, how the hell did you bag a set of Toby-TABs for only $20? The going rate while they were available was $66/set. Walt Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=256694.4002236.5216697.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=170512 6215:HM/A=1784493/R=0/id=noscript/SIG=11q7p9e7k/*http://webevents.yahoo.co m/universal/intolerablecruelty/> <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=256694.4002236.5216697.1261774/D=egroupm ail/S=:HM/A=1784493/rand=241464784> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: DMCForum-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
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