Re: [DML] Modified Trailing Arms For 1/2" Bolts

["K.L. (KAYO) Ong" <klo@xxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Jon:

You're an "A&P?"  I am an "A&P" since 1970...

Kayo


On Feb 8, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Jon Lockwood wrote:

> You are my kind of person. Touché!  Great story.  I worked on  
> F-4's, F15's,
> A10's and many other aircraft.  I left that job and went to  
> SATCOM..  Planes
> are really dirty.  That's not why I cross trained.  No future in  
> it..  Today
> the only plane I would feel safe in is a C130..  My Fav!
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jon Lockwood" <jn_lockwood@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 7:11 AM
> Subject: Re: [DML] Modified Trailing Arms For 1/2" Bolts
>
>
>> So we some metallurgy people on this site?  COOL!
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Martin Gutkowski" <martin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2012 1:53 AM
>> Subject: Re: [DML] Modified Trailing Arms For 1/2" Bolts
>>
>>
>>> Actually while hard materials tend to be brittle, it's not the same
>>> thing. Soft is not the same as ductile - eg carbon fibre  
>>> composite has a
>>> very high tensile strength and low ductility but is nowhere near  
>>> as hard
>>> as even aluminium.
>>>
>>> Hardness is a surface property, brittleness (resistance to crack
>>> propagation) and tensile strength, modulus of elasticity and  
>>> ductility
>>> are all structural properties.
>>>
>>> Martin
>>> Sent from my BlackBerry®
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: "K.L. (KAYO) Ong" <klo@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sender: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Date: Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:15:08
>>> To: <dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Reply-To: dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: [DML] Modified Trailing Arms For 1/2" Bolts
>>>
>>> Too much hardness (brittle) is just as bad as too soft (ductile)...
>>> As for Toby's bolts.... So far, Toby's bolt has been serving my car
>>> very well on the roads and streets of NYC. since his introduction
>>> many years ago.   Before Toby's bolts, I had replace the trailing
>>> arms bolt twice!  First time, they were both bolts were bent upon
>>> inspection.  The right side bolt was more bent to the point a  
>>> shim or
>>> two fell out.  The second time the right side bolt had actually
>>> snapped (sheared) off on a right turn!!!  I was luck to be one block
>>> from home...  Anyway, my DeLorean was then towed to Rob to have the
>>> replacement to have Toby's bolt installed...
>>>
>>> For what it is worth about softness and hardness about metals from
>>> the aviation industry....
>>>
>>> Some years ago a helicopter had crashed.  Upon inspection, the
>>> primary rotor blade's pivot securing bolt was at fault.  This bolt
>>> was made in mainland China, where quality control was not a critical
>>> issue.  To the manufacture, steel is steel... The problem was the
>>> bolt produced was way too soft and did not meet the required  
>>> Rockwell
>>> hardness test as prescribed....  The bolt cost was $5.00 US.... It
>>> was five dollars versus the $20.00 US approved bolt by the
>>> F.A.A.!!!    From that failure there were major lawsuits and I
>>> believe the Chinese manufacture got away with it, for one, it was
>>> overseas and government affiliated and two, the company just closed
>>> shop and change it's name... So, that is about soft metal.
>>>
>>> In the USA aviation industry/manufacturing, the rivets that are used
>>> are sent frozen from the manufactures until they are ready for usage
>>> upon assembly.  If the rivets are removed from the freezer and they
>>> are not used and or they have been sitting around beyond a  
>>> designated
>>> time, they are automatically scrapped.  The reason is because the
>>> room temperature with bring up the molecules movements which raise
>>> their brittleness (work harden by temperature)... And also, the
>>> assembler who is pneumatically hammering the rivets must know that
>>> there are a prescribed amount of "hits" allow to the rivets.   
>>> This is
>>> to not to over "work harden" the rivets upon compression which may
>>> create a condition for premature failure!!!  Just several years ago,
>>> we have seen planes in the news with the fuselage parts ripped  
>>> off or
>>> fallen off...  Rivet, rivet...  That is hardness in metals....
>>>
>>> Kayo Ong
>>> #5508
>>> Lic  9D NY
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Feb 7, 2012, at 1:53 PM, Matthew wrote:
>>>
>>>> http://www.industrialchassisinc.com/Web-blog/?p=622
>>>>
>>>> --- In dmcnews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Martin Gutkowski" <martin@...>  
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Tensile strength is only part of the story, you have to be
>>>> careful with ductility, aka "brittleness" and in general with steel
>>>> the higher the tensile strength, the more brittle it becomes. A
>>>> suspension component should have a degree of ductility, but not to
>>>> the point of fatigue or elastic limit. The torque spec for the TABs
>>>> is far lower than would normally be applied to such a bolt.
>>>>>
>>>>> Martin
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>
>
>
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