RE: [DMCForum] A public response to a private message: respect and courtesy

["timnagin" <timnagin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I am glad you posted that, Marc.  I also have to point this out as well,
"...this thread had finally died a long and painful death."  Huh?

To me, the "what oil should I use?" debates that come up on a regular basis
are way more painful.  I have no problem with Mike Griese, and am glad to
see he offered a reason why he rejected the post.

Greg



-----Original Message-----
From: Marc Levy [mailto:malevy_nj@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2005 3:47 PM
To: DMCForum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [DMCForum] A public response to a private message: respect and
courtesy



This is a response to a private message sent to me by
Ralf.  I thought there may be public interest in this,
as further example of what goes on with DML
moderators.

You may want to read from the bottom first to
understand my response.


Ralf,

I'd like to see the feedback that led to the
conclusion of "should table this discussion at least
or a while so the people involved can cool down a
bit.".

What is to cool down from?  We are all quite cool!
The facts speak for themselves, the problem is that
many facts are censored by the moderators.
EEspeciallywhen the facts are about them.

The impact of the DMC Forum on the DML is incredible.
Because there is now a unmoderated mailing list where
these facts can be made known (even if it is to a
smaller audience), it has forced the DML moderators to
allow things that in the past they would have
rejected.

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DMCForum/

I recall a post a few weeks back where Jack Singer
said "would recommend a new forum if this is not
answered."  Lots of people were upset about this, but
I admit the private e-mail stopped abruptly when the
topic was no longer seen on the DML.  Is it over now??
 I don't know, but even with me being a "trouble
maker", things always seem to get back to normal in
short order..  The more recent "endotex" situation is
another example.

Either way Ralf, I thank you for taking the time to
aattemptto be heard.  Furthermore, I encourage people
to be heard even if I disagree with them.

"Society honors its living conformist and its dead
trouble makers." ~ Mignon McLaughlin


--- Ralf Philipp <enteklemmer@xxxxxx> wrote:

> Hi!
>
> I just want to forward you a message that was not
> approved for the DML. I
> respect the reasons why it was not approved by Mike
> Griese, but I want at
> least you to know what I had to say.
> I also forwarded this message to James Espey.
>
> bye,
> Ralf.
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: mike.griese@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:mike.griese@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Gesendet: Samstag, 8. Januar 2005 16:59
> An: Ralf Philipp
> Betreff: Message not approved: respect and courtesy
>
>
>
> Ralf - I am declining this post for a couple of
> reasons, foremost is that this thread had finally
> died a long and painful death.  The feedback that
> we have received from the list is that we should
> table this discussion at least for a while so the
> people involved can cool down a bit.
>
> I would like to respond to your point 3 regarding
> the moderators.  There are some activities that
> go on in the background that can lead to a delay
> in a post getting dispositioned.  Anytime we get a
> post that makes a significant accusation about
> anybody on the list, we will try to get both sides
> of the story before we allow anything through. In
> the case of the post that started this thread (Marc
> Levy's post regarding SonnyVR), given the nature of
> the situation, we wanted to at least try and confirm
> the allegations before dealing with the post.  We
> had some problems getting in contact with James,
> which lead in part to the delays.  We understand
> how that can be misinterpreted by some on the list,
> but there is not much we can do about it.  We did
> eventually pass Marc's post through once we were
> confident it had some veracity.  It is unfortunate
> that James has cchosen not to respond, but we
> can't twist his arm on that.
>
> Mike G.
>
> > hi list, hi moderators
> > I try to make it short:
> >
> > 1.) to Marc L., Darryl T. and Evil Dan:
> > I agree with you 100% on this topic and I have the
> feeling that
> most of the
> > long-time DML-members do so also. Perhaps they
> don't speak up for
> a reason
> > that was mentioned by Evil Dan: "It's just not
> worth our time."
> And this is
> > also my reason. It is not worth my time to get
> into discussion
> with stupid
> > persons. On the other hand, if noone speaks up,
> this kind of sh*t
> will
> > happen again and again.
> >
> >
> > 2.) to the ones misleading their fellow members,
> > to the ones trying so hard to boost their egos,
> > to the ones just adding to the noise on the DML,
> > WHY DON'T YOU JUST LEAVE THE DML? PLEASE?
> >
> >
> > 3.) to the moderators:
> > I have no prove for it, but I have the strong
> feeling that some of
> you tried
> > to sweep the whole issue under the carpet. Please
> be honest to
> yourself,
> > reflect your actions regarding this topic, and try
> to maintain a
> climate of
> > openness, honesty and respect on the list. And
> please try to be
> unbiased.
> >
> >
> > 4.) to James E.:
> > Please try to remember the times when you still
> were "Iron Hand
> Espey" :-)
> > How would you have judged about someone acting the
> way you do
> nowadays,
> > regarding the SonnyV issue? I am sure you would
> not have tolerated
> such
> > behavior, would you?
> > I think you made a big error and I still hope you
> will apologize
> for it
> > publicly.
> >
> >
> > Ralf
> > VIN 10284

---

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